Gun Control & RKBA

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)

92. Creative writing, or the NRA rewriting history?

Thu Sep 1, 2016, 03:45 PM

Sep 2016

Timeline:
February 26, 2012 - George Zimmerman, a neighborhood watch captain in Sanford, Florida, calls 911 to report "a suspicious person" in the neighborhood. He is instructed not to get out of his SUV or approach the person. Zimmerman disregards the instructions. Moments later, neighbors report hearing gunfire. Zimmerman acknowledges that he shot Martin, claiming it was in self-defense. In a police report, Officer Timothy Smith writes that Zimmerman was bleeding from the nose and back of the head.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/05/us/trayvon-martin-shooting-fast-facts/

Instructed to not get out.....

It wasn’t enough for George Zimmerman to kill Trayvon Martin.
In an interview with The Daily Beast this week, Zimmerman made it clear he has no remorse about shooting the 17-year-old boy to death in Sanford, Florida, and bears outright hostility for the parents whose son he took away forever.
“They didn’t raise their son right. He attacked a complete stranger and attempted to kill him,” Zimmerman said of Martin.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/05/17/george-zimmerman-taunts-trayvon-martin-s-parents-they-didn-t-raise-their-son-right.html

Zimmerman is an unrepentant murderer. SO yes, there is some "creative remembering" happening here. Feel free to post a refutation. With links.

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Yup, it's officially a moral panic: [View all] friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 OP

Not really surprised at the crying Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #1

Should have provided a trigger-warning to the class. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #2

Nice! Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #10

A site to explore: guillaumeb Aug 2016 #3

How many were on a campus? Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #4

"I bet the percentage is actually quite miniscule." It is - see post #5 friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #6

I know, that poster Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #7

Check out the site. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #8

And once again, 2/3 are suicides Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #9

How many murders are committed by someone who then commits suicide? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #11

I expect much less than single suicide. Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #16

And no good is done by attemting to discuss murder in context of small sub-groups guillaumeb Aug 2016 #19

2/3 of the deaths you cite are suicide, not homicide. nt Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #24

The 30,000 dead remain dead. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #43

This context-free burbling re. '30,000 dead' is a good example of why you're failing. pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #48

"30,000 dead" in this case is a 'thought-terminating cliche': friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #64

Yes. Yes it is. pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #65

To be polite; "Overly Simplistic" applies DonP Aug 2016 #70

You are correct, of course, Don........ pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #77

We should catalog Thought-terminating cliches. One of the ones I notice most in GD is Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #68

We need a new thread for that but: discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2016 #69

Since I have to comb through GD for gun posts, it shouldn't be a surprise. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #71

"The nutters will be along any minute now to explain this away." pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #78

Except suicide is not murder Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #42

The 30,000 dead remain dead. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #44

2/3 by their own choice Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #46

Not only that but they remain deader than those who... discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2016 #49

i agree beergood Aug 2016 #54

That would be a larger topic, but we were speaking of "death by gun". guillaumeb Aug 2016 #55

so your saying beergood Aug 2016 #56

I already answered your question. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #57

"And this IS a gun group. Perhaps you should post on this topic." beergood Sep 2016 #117

My shooting is confined to one gun at this point. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #119

"Do you hunt also?" beergood Sep 2016 #120

It sounds like one of these. oneshooter Sep 2016 #121

forgive my ignorance beergood Sep 2016 #122

Definitions oneshooter Sep 2016 #123

thanks beergood Sep 2016 #124

No problem. oneshooter Sep 2016 #125

whats it like beergood Sep 2016 #126

Since I am a traditional shooter I shoot mainly Flint. Locks with PRB. oneshooter Sep 2016 #128

I do not hunt any longer. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #127

Where do you see that? Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #14

The attempt by some gun enthusiasts to divide gun owners into guillaumeb Aug 2016 #21

Attempt by some banners to apply Orwell to the King's English. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #26

Ahh, gotcha. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #27

Just as all car owners are responsible for traffic deaths. friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #20

None of the objects mentioned are designed specifically to kill. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #22

But they *do* kill on occasion. Are those killed by cars and drugs less dead than shooting victims? friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #25

Using the standard in #19, no. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #28

Is killing absolutely bad? Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #31

What if you were the target? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #51

You're evading. What if I was the target? Would using deadly force to stop that person be bad? Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #52

You asked originally if killing was bad. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #53

"Unanswerable with no context." Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #59

Self defense is a concept that I believe in. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #60

Fine words, indeed- but they do not answer the question asked. Here it is again: friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #62

Particular cases do not have bearing on a right. Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #66

That "right" is an inextricable part of the case. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #73

Oh nonsense. beevul Aug 2016 #75

The claim that Zimmerman exercised a right has no bearing to anyone outside of the case. Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #76

Yes it was self defense gejohnston Aug 2016 #79

Is this the official NRA fairy story version of the murder of Trayvon Martin? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #80

It is the objective facts and evidence presented at trial gejohnston Aug 2016 #81

Objective facts has nothing to do with this. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #82

Objective facts have everything to do with it gejohnston Aug 2016 #83

He baited you and you took it. Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #84

go figure gejohnston Aug 2016 #85

So poor George Zimmerman is actually the victim in all this? guillaumeb Sep 2016 #86

The character of persons in particular cases have no bearing on rights in other cases friendly_iconoclast Sep 2016 #87

Zimmerman was looking for an excuse to use his gun. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #88

Wow! That's a pretty "creative" interpretation of the actual evidence and testimony DonP Sep 2016 #89

Creative writing, or the NRA rewriting history? guillaumeb Sep 2016 #92

So the NRA rewrote the court records? DonP Sep 2016 #94

Oh wise man, you forgot your link. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #95

No, what I forgot is that gun control fans are lazy as well as cheap DonP Sep 2016 #96

You made a specific allegation. You have refused to back it up. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #111

So, we'll add "not the sharpest pencil in the drawer" to lazy and cheap DonP Sep 2016 #112

More evasion and avoidance. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #113

If I'm attacked without provocation and fear grave bodily injury do I have a right to Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #114

Yes. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #115

You need to be provided evidence that courts keep records? N/T beevul Sep 2016 #116

Way, way too much like work, ... easier to rely on cartoons for your opinions DonP Sep 2016 #118

Thats your opinion. beevul Sep 2016 #90

For the sake of argument, let us concede that your estimate of him is correct. friendly_iconoclast Sep 2016 #91

No, it does not. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #93

If someone, without provocation, threatened me with grave injury or death would I Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #97

Of course NOT!!! oneshooter Sep 2016 #99

I wish my other interlocutor would answer the question. He's made a point to answer so many other Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #100

I think you scare him. n/t oneshooter Sep 2016 #103

I can't imagine anyone less imposing than me. Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #106

But.....but.....but............. pablo_marmol Sep 2016 #109

Nor are they specifically designed to defend oneself. Straw Man Aug 2016 #47

30,000 misrepresented statistics. JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #34

You are denying difference in circumstances, which prevents effective action to prevent those deaths krispos42 Sep 2016 #129

If poverty and social inequality are the primary causes of crime. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #130

Thank you krispos42 Sep 2016 #131

A fisking of that site that will give the doctrinaire a sad: friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #5

30,000 gun deaths a year. Keep parsing and explaining. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #12

Your collective guilt-tripping and appeals to emotion seem not to be gaining traction friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #13

A certain number of people literally do not care about others. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #17

And those individual people are responsible, not an entire group friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #23

Yes. Some of them focus on what other people own. beevul Aug 2016 #33

30,000 gun dead are also the consequences of choices. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #35

Not my choices. N/T beevul Aug 2016 #36

I agree - at least 2/3 are in that example...suicide and all. Guess most are in fact, as others jmg257 Aug 2016 #41

I suppose the only way to show care is a gun ban? ileus Aug 2016 #45

"A certain number of people literally do not care about others." beergood Sep 2016 #98

Remarkable few of which were caused by by the group under discussion friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #15

What is the source of the electricity? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #18

A thoughtful reply to a question not asked- and I should have said CNG vehicles, not electric ones friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #29

If you had specified CNG, I would have responded: guillaumeb Aug 2016 #37

Isn't it a sad commentary virginia mountainman Aug 2016 #39

This message was self-deleted by its author JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #30

532 people have been killed by police so far this year. JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #32

Are you suggesting disarming the police? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #38

Except the police aren't covered by the Second Amendment. JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #40

Interesting - 885 total permit-related gun deaths in 9 years... jmg257 Aug 2016 #58

Now estimated at 14 million permits, not counting constitutional carry states DonP Aug 2016 #61

Indeed so Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #63

While around 1200 criminals are responsible for over 400 deaths in Chicago alone every year. jmg257 Aug 2016 #67

There has been very little comment from the other TX colleges. Hangingon Aug 2016 #50

In UT lit classes, the study of Long Dong Silver is required. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #72

Our Flagship university! Hangingon Aug 2016 #74

This message was self-deleted by its author apcalc Sep 2016 #101

What ought to be done until concealed carry is revoked: no_hypocrisy Sep 2016 #102

In most states that is already the law. Duckhunter935 Sep 2016 #104

Great idea, we can call that sort of action... SQUEE Sep 2016 #105

Along with about 40+ or so other states DonP Sep 2016 #107

And they see no_hypocrisy in arguing from a position of ignorance........ pablo_marmol Sep 2016 #108

No, they really take great pride in not knowing things DonP Sep 2016 #110