I think, I finally understand why people vote Trump. It has nothing to do with fascism or racism.

[DetlefK]

Last edited Sun Jan 5, 2025, 06:46 AM - Edit history (1)

Why are there so many muslim terrorist groups?

Islam regards itself not merely as the correct religion (obviously). It regards itself as the improved and enlightened successor to Christianity, just as Christians regard themselves as the improved and enlightened successors to Judaism.

By virtue of having the correct religion they are entitled to a better life, to preferential treatment and superiority.
And what do they get in reality? Poverty, dictators, oppression... Being looked down upon and dominated by the sinful, by the morally inferior Christians.
So, what is the solution? Take by force what you are rightfully owed.



Why did the Germans so eagerly and willfully join the Nazis?

About 2000 years ago, the german tribes became vassals to the Roman Empire. As the power of the empire waned (because desperately needed political reforms were overlooked), it was forced to outsource more and more power to their german (now) allies. When the West-Roman Empire became politically defunct, the german lords and kings simply filled the power-vacuum. From there, the Germans built an empire that stretched from the Atlantic Ocean to Poland, Hungary and Yugoslavia. From the North-Sea to the Mediterranean Sea. It lasted 1000 years. For 1000 years, the Germans dominated Europe geopolitically. This was the First Reich.
Then came a time of weakness: Being forced to become vassals of Napoleon. Austria breaking away and becoming its own empire.
Then came a time of greatness again. The squabbling german states bonded together and the concept of a singular german nation was born. Filled with fresh power and national pride, greatness was at the fingertips of the Germans once more. This was the Second Reich.
Then came defeat in WWI, humiliation on an irrational scale, and an unjust peace, followed by the Great Depression and political instability and weakness.

By virtue of historical right and heritage the Germans are entitled to rule Europe.
And what do they get in reality? Strife, chaos, violence, poverty, humiliation.
So, what is the solution? Follow the guy who promises to build The Third Reich, no matter how repulsive his policies. What needs to be done, needs to be done.



Why do Americans so eagerly and willfully follow Trump?

The US is the best country ever. It has Manifest Destiny. It has "Freedom(TM)". It has the best economic system ever: Capitalism, of course. It has the best religion ever: Christianity, of course.

By virtue of the geopolitical power of their country, Americans are entitled to a good life.
By just being in the right place at the right time, by chanting the correct jingoism, by indulging in consumerism as they are told to do, by fighting for their religious morals as they perceive them, everything is supposed to go swimmingly.

And what do Americans get in reality?
Somehow everybody gets richer, but its never you. Success-story after success-story, but never you.
Money always tight.
Immoral people in charge.
And then, all of a sudden, these new minorities spring up out of nowhere and they get talked about, and somehow everybody is obsessed with if and how to shape a place for these NEW PEOPLE in our society.
But what about you?
You do everything right, you do as you are told to do, you believe what you are told to believe, you consume what you are told to consume, yet your life doesn't get any better. WHERE IS THIS PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT THAT YOU WERE BEING PROMISED?

So, what is the solution? Follow the guy who is not business-as-usual. The guy who promises to take care of you. The guy who makes the conversation about you. They guy who promises that doing as HE tells you to do, and that believing what HE tells you to believe, and consuming what HE tells you to consume, will finally solve all your problems.





EDIT:
The system of capitalism, of lobbyism, has failed these people. But the thought that then the current system needs to be changed is outlandish and plain inconceivable to these people, because it has been drilled into their heads that the current system is the best. And so they blame scapegoats: The people who disturb the current system.

They want change, yet want everything to stay exactly the same at the same time.

[elleng]

1. "Christians regard themselves as the improved and enlightened successors to Judaism.'

Gee, I missed THAT part of my religious education.

[stopdiggin]

3. most certainly DID !

but, that's OK - I slept through a lot of that stuff too ... - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

[Bernardo de La Paz]

10. It's implicit. And that "part" has been a huge thrust of the history of hatred against Jews

Christian religious history is often pitched as replacing jewish religion and ways which were the old ways and now we are modern and we have Jesus and christianity and these muslims are just "other" or a heretic schism or worse.

Christians don't often (rarely?) call themselves chosen, reserving that terminology for jews, sometimes derisively so. But christians sure act that way.

Christians don't often (rarely?) call themselves superior to jews, but they sure act that way, frequently in history and too often even now.

To ignore the historical aspect is to forget that the Nazis maintained a veneer of christianity about their official operations, jews were persecuted throughout Europe, facing pogroms (ethnic cleansing) in Russia, Inquisition in Spain, and many more genocidal racist christianist attacks.

[Retrograde]

31. A more polite (?) way to put it

based on what they told me in 12 years of Catholic schools, the birth and death of Jesus fulfilled what was foretold in the Old Testament (well, the OT was cherrypicked and re-interpreted to make it look that way), or Judaism was the parent and Christianity was the brash, young kid about to make his way in the greater world. Realistically, it was more about seizing and keeping power after the western Roman empire collapsed.

[Think. Again.]

11. That was one of the many reasons young me dropped the charade of religion...

...the "Jews killed jesus" thing was just too hurtful to my good Jewish friends, and once I began seeing that one hole in the christian rhetoric, the rest just blatantly fell apart.

I did strongly support the Humanitarian aspects of the 'Hippy Jesus Freak' movement of the early 70's, but that was just a flash in the pan and was hi-jacked quickly by the rightwingers with the "I found jesus!" garbage to get money from people.

Luckily, I found Humanism -"Good Without A God".

[pandr32]

29. That is why the Flavians created it.

They wanted to fold Judea into the Roman Empire with less contention. 'Christianity' was more tolerant of Rome than Judaism with strict laws, so they made an observant Jew into one that preached tolerance and acceptance of their lot in life.

[Trust_Reality]

30. I heard a lot of negative stuff about Pharisees when I was a kid exposed to a large amount of Southern Baptist cultism.

Before I escaped that cultism.

[stopdiggin]

2. interesting. except for the fact that Trump really ISN'T promising

any of those things to the working class slobs. What he is promising - is anti-immigration, anti-trans, anti-muslim, anti-choice, anti-inclusion (EDI) ....

And that sounds a whole lot like hatred, racism (and, yes, fascism) to most of us.
Problem solving? Solutions? That seems pretty thin on the ground ...
And one could almost argue - not really even the point.

[Think. Again.]

12. oh he's promising them those things...

...they just can't see that the promises are lies, because he once had a tv show.

[dalton99a]

21. +1. He promised them stuff at every campaign stop

"Vote Trump and your incomes will soar. Your net worth will skyrocket. Your energy costs and grocery prices will come tumbling down."
- Donald Trump, September 23, 2024

[Think. Again.]

22. A modern-day snake oil salesman, with a sadistic edge.

[stopdiggin]

25. affordable housing, better schools, affordable medical care, job protection ?

I guess maybe we're listening to different speeches.

[Think. Again.]

28. Different speeches, different lies.

[Ferrets are Cool]

16. I was going to post the same thing. He ran on hatred. His people ate it up.

[RainCaster]

4. it's only about HATE

It's all about making hate socially acceptable. That's all. There are so many as Christians who subscribe to this. That is why.

[claudette]

5. Because they are

as crazy and nasty as he is

[ThePartyThatListens]

6. Oh it's the racism all right

And Trump isn't the problem, his supporters are.

It's what they've been craving all along and they've finally got it.

Let's see how they like it.

[Attilatheblond]

27. Trump saw their anger, racism, sexism and THAT is why he went from D to R

When his business failures made him seek public office for all the grifting opportunities it afforded someone with no ethical inhibitions. Then, after finding himself being held accountable for some of his crimes, and broke again, he was forced to secure the presidency again, by whatever means required.

[arthritisR_US]

7. Are you saying Islam put the orange shit into office?

[DetlefK]

9. WTF? Maybe read beyond the first three lines?

My argument is that people support extremist ideas because society/religion/history has not delivered what it said it would deliver.

[William769]

8. The hatred of Christianity to dismiss Racism I find repugnant & very telling.

[malaise]

13. A fascinating OP

Food for thought

Question - are there more Muslim terrorist groups than there are in the West and Israel?

[Martin Eden]

14. Trump won partly due to religion, but largely because a large swath of American voters are disinformed

Donald Trump is a pathological liar, but his voting base believe he "tells it like it is." THAT, above all else, tells the tale of Trump’s political success.

Decades of "conservative" propaganda laid the groundwork for the orange con man. When big lies are repeated often enough, falsehoods become truth to people who don't know any better.

Religious folk, especially in (but not confined to) rural and small town America, have come to believe the Republican Party stands for Christian America, family values, and fiscal responsibility.

The depth of this deception is illustrated by the belief that Donald Trump -- the most irreligious and morally corrupt monster ever to poison our political landscape -- was anointed by God to save America.

Religion is indeed a major factor, but not without BIG LIES being embraced as truth by tens of millions of voters.

Disinformation prevailed in the 2024 election.

Christians voted for the money changers in the temple.

People struggling financially believed America's economy was in shambles, when in fact Bidenomics accomplished a post pandemic recovery that was the envy of advanced industrialized nations.

They believed violent crime was rampant, even though it's declining. They believed undocumented immigrants were a big source of crime, even though they are more law abiding than American citizens. They believed Haitians were eating household pets.

They believe that billionaires like Trump and Musk who push tax cuts for the rich will help ordinary folks struggling to get by.

And YES -- they believe these greedy assholes who threaten American democracy are the champions of Christian values and American greatness.

[travelingthrulife]

17. You should publish this as an opinion.

It is so very true.

It is what happens when you intertwine your politics and religion. You cannot deny one without denying the other.

[Think. Again.]

23. I agree, that should be widely published.

[chia]

15. Thought-provoking. Thank you for posting.

[ananda]

18. Actually it has EVERYTHING to do with class warfare, which is ...

grounded in fascism, racism, and misogyny.

[Scrivener7]

19. Correct. But scratch at that thinking a little and you'll find it is based on racism and sexism.

"They're not entitled to it. I am entitled to it. And if they get some, there is less for the rightful recipients like me."

[JanMichael]

20. Like those angry Germans after WWI they may be very sorry for what they wrought upon themselves..t

Because of hurt feelings.

[La Coliniere]

24. There is much to ponder in your post.

However, I still believe that racism, misogyny and xenophobia are a large part of why people voted for the felon. I know this is strictly anecdotal, but when I asked 4 members of my extended family why they voted for the felon, here are their responses. Let me add that all 4 are solidly middle class and comfortable financially. These responses are not verbatim, but very close to their actual answers.
1. She can never be in control of our military, never!
2. My health care premiums were just increased again because that California governor is giving the immigrants free healthcare and driver licenses.
3. A woman can’t stand up to international threats. People would never respect her.
4. I’m sick of giving my tax money to people who don’t want to get off their asses and find a job.
They all had other things to say but none really reflected what you expressed, but I do believe it underlies some of their feelings, being that it may be just under the surface.

[Oneear]

26. Donald J. Trump you dance is not working out What will the Mid Terms Bring?

Keep in mind Donald J. Trump is a Lame Duck